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From the Manga scans it is definite that Haruto Tenjo (manga) has 28, and form what I could gather it was another moulded at will Number, like 14 and 21. Photonkrios99 (talk • contribs) 21:21, November 21, 2013 (UTC)
- http://i.imgur.com/nufeb3k.jpg pic, lest I be called a hypocrite.Photonkrios99 (talk • contribs) 22:32, November 21, 2013 (UTC)
- Small question about 28's previous section, should we go with None as Haruto 'created' it, or does anyone know if he got the blank Number from Yagumo and if so would Yagumo giving him the blank Number be enough to say he's a previous owner?. Photonkrios99 (talk • contribs) 20:29, November 24, 2013 (UTC)
The Arclight's Numbers
Since we're not sure who specifically has the Numbers of the Arclight brothers after their duels with the Barians, why not use "Seven Barian Emperors" as a placeholder since dialogue implies that they at least took possession of them after defeating them.--BahamutX978 (talk • contribs) 19:28, November 25, 2013 (UTC)
- Because it is unknown and has not been directly stated/shown they have them. Photonkrios99 (talk • contribs) 19:52, November 25, 2013 (UTC)
- Because Durbe was joking. You know how funny can he be...
Yano, quit being a whiny brat or whatever on earth you're trying to be about the whole issue. There are more professional ways to argue about it than the way you are doing so. At this point you are contributing absolutely nothing to the discussion for the sake of what? A punch line? I don't even know what you are trying to accomplish anymore. Policy dictates that we do things a certain way. We can't change that. I'm sure Krios and a lot of other people support the idea that the Barians have these Numbers. But we can't put that in because we don't have definitive proof. Yes, it is implied. Yes, it seems incredibly obvious. But then again, Heliocentricism was once seen as "obviously wrong" and the one where everything revolved around the Earth was seen as "obviously correct". What that has to do with the discussion, nothing except that you can't just say something is so because it seems obvious that it is that way. Aeron Solo wuz here (If you wanna talk) 20:09, November 25, 2013 (UTC)
Ignoring the above spat, while which specific Barian holds them is up to speculation, since one of the Barians' goals is to collect the Numbers, it is clear that the group most likely took possession of them as a collective since after IV's defeat, Durbe lists off the remaining people with Numbers and Nasch orders everyone to split up and find them.--BahamutX978 (talk • contribs) 20:14, November 25, 2013 (UTC)
Sorry about said spat. That being said, if you scroll to the very end of it you will see the reason that we can't do that: it's implied. It's not explicitly stated, shown, etc. As such, our hands are tied. We can't do anything about "implied" because that which is "obviously implied to be correct" is not proof. For example, I could say that Z-One was Yusei before watching the episode that says that he was actually someone impersonating Yusei in every way. Also it was once "obvious" that Number 96 should have gone to Yuma after it was defeated. Yet, hey what's this? He's with...Vector??? That's the reason. Aeron Solo wuz here (If you wanna talk) 20:18, November 25, 2013 (UTC)
- Aye. Aeron makes excellent points. This was why I asked UK to lock the page temporaily... Sanokal K-T (talk • contribs) 20:21, November 25, 2013 (UTC)
- Fair enough. I figured offering a group term as the current possessor(s) would be better than just putting "Unknown" since we can't say who specifically because we don't see them obtained.
Also, just as a little extra comment, I always thought that the following episode made it clear that Vector got 96 since its power is part of the card. I never once thought that Yuma got 96 after that scene(same for 65 with it). But then again, that is a completely different discussion.--BahamutX978 (talk • contribs) 20:28, November 25, 2013 (UTC)
It is. I just offered that as an example of the discrepancies; I thought it was obvious up until 96's power was revealed to be with Don Thousand. At that point I hesitated. But that's beside the point. I'm truthfully all for putting down the Barian Emperors as the current holders but I know that it's not going to hold up against speculation unless the admins reeeaaaaalllly stretch that policy to its limits. Which they won't. It's not quite close enough for them to go that far. Aeron Solo wuz here (If you wanna talk) 20:40, November 25, 2013 (UTC)
Aeron dont lose your cool for my comments. If you find them unappropriate or off topic limit yourself to delete them. Dont go ahead writing poems about me :-D Also if I may add, Number 96 being with Yuma was never sure. In fact I was the first to suggest that it was with Vector since it was never shown to be absorbed by Astral. Finally I say that Seven Barian Emperors or even better "Barian World" or even a disclaimer (because you were a fan of it since last week, now no more) is better than Unknown because what Durbe said is much of a proof. Also Unknown is wrong. We do know where those Numbers are. They are at the disposal of the Barians. ---> Barian World > Unknown. More logic and offers more information about those cards.
ps: It wasnt me who re opened this discussion. I just made a joke about Durbe so next time, just chill before going rage on me.
- Please explain how Durbe listing people with Numbers is proof that they have acquired more, because I would really like to know. An Unknown is not wrong as we have NO CHARACTER IN WHICH TO ATTRIBUTE THE NUMBERS TO. I would also like an explanation as to how the Barian World can own things, last I checked non sentient things are in capable of such feats.Photonkrios99 (talk • contribs) 21:58, November 25, 2013 (UTC)
- Yes of course Durbe saying to Nasch (after the duel against IV) that the Numbers Holder now are just III, V and Yuma definitely means that Gimmick Puppet Numbers are left with IV on the ground or maybe some fairy ghost of the Astral World took them XD If you dont want to put Barian World even Nasch would be better since, from the start of the anime, when a Number Hunter defeat another one, he usually takes the Numbers. XD Anyway for me this discussion is over since weeks.
- Im not telling you anything. Like I said discussing this matter is time wasted. "We dont have evidences, hands tied". God, this really seems the CIA wikia XD. I already made my point clear. Unknown is wrong since we know, for sure, 100%, confirmed by the anime, that those Numbers are with the Barians now. Dont want to change. Fine by me. I'll try to live on lol.
Calm down, everyone, this isn't getting us anywhere.
Instead of changing the location in the table, might it be prudent to mention elsewhere that while the locations of the Arclight's Number's are unknown, they are presumably in the hands of the Barians? Same going for Djinn Buster being with Vector. Of course, this would be for the time being until furthur information is revealed. At least this way it comes to both sides of the arguement. Sanokal K-T (talk • contribs) 22:58, November 25, 2013 (UTC)
- ^This, seriously it's a nice middle ground which should allow conflict to be avoided... please? XD --slave(command•works) 23:22, November 25, 2013 (UTC)
- First of all, I'm glad this is being discussed. Because not doing so will do nothing but get the page locked again.
- If it was my call alone, I would say "put Seven Barian Emperors". It would make no sense for them not to take them, given that's their entire goal. However, one could argue that the "Numbers" just vanished altogether and no one has them and that their goal would still be accomplished with the "Numbers" are gone.
- In almost all cases, I hate the idea of putting "presumably" anywhere on this wiki. This is one of the cases I would make an exception for, given that I expect we'll get in-universe clarification eventually and how obvious it seems. So yes, I have no problem with "presumably" in this case.
- I can't just say yes or no though. What does everyone else think? Cheesedude (talk • contribs) 01:34, November 26, 2013 (UTC)
- Truthfully, I don't see a good answer anywhere. Unknown is truthful and adheres to policy, but personally unsatisfactory nonetheless. At this point though it seems a lot of people seem to agree that the only way they could go anywhere else would be extremely unlikely circumstances. Policy vs. "Duh they obviously took tehm" is the only point of this long argument. If Cheesedude is willing to stretch the boundaries of policy to fit over this, then I give "Barian Emperors" my vote as well. Aeron Solo wuz here (If you wanna talk) 01:42, November 26, 2013 (UTC)
I'd prefer presumably, but I don't mind either way, just as long as we can clear this up. The reason that I initially mentioned that was due to its use (although far moer justified) in the Wicked God article that states that presumably Bandit Keith still has his copy of the "Eraser", (though it also notes that he hated the card.) Sanokal K-T (talk • contribs) 03:10, November 26, 2013 (UTC)
- I feel listing them with the 7BE would be best as it is as Aeron put a 'Duh' situation. Photonkrios99 (talk • contribs) 07:43, November 26, 2013 (UTC)
Finally... Thanks for understanding.
- Yeah, all because you couldn't deal with the fact that we were stating what we actually know and not jumping to conclusions. You just wouldn't stop bringing this up until you had your way. Congratulations, you got it. NMBRHNTR64 (talk • contribs) 13:44, November 26, 2013 (UTC)
I think it would be because 96 was last owner of Number 65 and his own card. Then when Don Vector re-absorbed him, he also got Number 96's card. Therefore, Vector should have absorbed Number 65 as well. But we'll probably have to talk with Cheesedude on that one...Over-HundredLegendaryChaosShiningNumbers (talk • contribs) 15:34, November 26, 2013 (UTC)
- That issue will propbably resolve itself soon enough anyway seeing as Vector is shown using C65 in the opening. The only question then is if we should just wait for him to summon it or just take pre-emptive action there.--BahamutX978 (talk • contribs) 17:57, November 26, 2013 (UTC)
Original CNo. count
Because I can foresee a page lock/edit war coming on, can people please stop +7ing the Cno. count, It's for the CNo. versions of the original Numebrs and does not include the 10X versions. Photonkrios99 (talk • contribs) 22:22, December 4, 2013 (UTC)
well Number 10x are still apart of the number archetype, and No C10x are still part of the no C, so they must be noted, as the page represents no only the archetype in relation to the series, but the game aswell..F8lfire (talk • contribs) 23:08, December 4, 2013 (UTC)
- But noted on a section that explicitly states Original, I don't think so, they are mentioned on the pages you have stated but they are not apart of the originals therefore should not be apart of the count. Photonkrios99 (talk • contribs) 23:15, December 4, 2013 (UTC)
Numbers 80 and 58 might be Fake Numbers
So I don't know how many people watched the episode today, but Astral noticed that when Gilag summoned Burner Visor, Don Thousand's power was coming from it, or something to that effect, and said something about it being similar to when Alito was possessed. I don't actually know the specific details of what he said as my japanese is pretty bad, but I'm going to throw this out right now: This might mean that 58 and 80 are fake numbers. Don't actually do anything until either the subs come out or someone with better japanese listens to that statement and tells us exactly what he said. He might just have been saying that the two were extra sources of control by Don Thousand or something; Astral did say something about them being related to the "sealing" or whatever of Alitto and Gilag. Aeron Solo wuz here (If you wanna talk) 16:38, December 8, 2013 (UTC)
- 1;58 is confirmed to be released this/next month, so I ask why would they release a fake Number?
- 2;96 IS a shard of DT's power, so how can, Senses DT be a reason for fake when we know that 96 is a legit Number with Astrals Memories and all? Photonkrios99 (talk • contribs) 19:15, December 8, 2013 (UTC)
1: Fake Numbers also look like a lot of fun to play with. I would really like a number of fake numbers to be released just to spice up the series a little. 2: I already said, I didn't understand what he said entirely. I already acknowledged that they might just have been corrupted. I posted to give everyone a heads up, not to actually change anything. I don't know any of the specifics. 3: What on earth are you saying with your second point??? Is that even proper english??? What I see is that you're saying that 96 is an actual number that was corrupted, which might account for the fact that DT's power was coming from 58. Is that true? If so then my above points apply to that statement: I don't know what he specifically said, I'm just seeing we need to get that part translated so we know what's up. Aeron Solo wuz here (If you wanna talk) 19:50, December 8, 2013 (UTC)
- Yes, bad english on 2, sorry about that, I meant to say, I don't see how it can be suggested that if Astral makes a comment regarding DT's power about a Number how we can turn around and label it fake instantly especially when 96, which we know was a legit Number was the same way. On the point of releasing Fakes, Can you all subjectivity aside can you really see Konami releasing cards that would mess up a very collectable archetype like that. Photonkrios99 (talk • contribs) 20:40, December 8, 2013 (UTC)
- A card being released in the TCG/OCG is irrelevant to the point. The Duel Dragons from the 5D's manga are just re-utilizing the Signer Dragons in a different way. And yet despite having the same appearance and similar names, they were/are being release in the TCG/OCG. At some point when they can figure out a way to make them legit, I'm certain Number 1-4 will be release at some point in the future. I mean it took them, what, a year and a half or so to release Dragonecro to the public? --Rocket.knight.777 (talk • contribs) 06:53, December 19, 2013 (UTC)
- Except the Duel Dragons and Signer Dragons are two different plot points from two different continuities, and neither are claimed to be a part of the other, they just fill their respective gaps in the Manga and Anime. Where as the Fake Numbers are presented to use as claiming to be something they are not, which means it would be counter productive to release any number that was a fake, especially when Konami acknowledges that they are rather collectable Archtype, hens why NUMH had it listed as one of its selling points. Photonkrios99 (talk • contribs) 12:28, December 21, 2013 (UTC)
Prime Photon Dragon's Number location.
I know we could probably wait until the "Number Flash" on the show, but if you look closely at Prime Photon Dragon's left wing, you can see his Number. NovaTsukimori (talk • contribs) 04:41, December 19, 2013 (UTC)
- It's already been added to the table. Photonkrios99 (talk • contribs) 06:42, December 19, 2013 (UTC)
"Numbers" part in Japanese names.
Shouldn't the "Numbers" part in the Japanese names be translated as "Numbers' XX" instead of "Numbers XX"? For example, No. 39 being "Numbers' 39 : King of Wishes Hope", because he is the "39" of the "Numbers" archetype ? HPZ - O.N.E. (talk • contribs) 08:38, December 19, 2013 (UTC)
So about their age....
"Reading history" So the Numeron Dragon, which created the Universe and the Numeron Code, borrowed the power of the Numbers to conceal its existence. Not only that, all of the Barian Emperors were connected to the Legendary Numbers in their past lives, however long ago they were. Dragluon even formed in Mizael's hand in a flashback in episode 135.
Was Yuma really the one who released the Numbers anymore? I mean come on, sure they said that in the beginning and it was reasonable to say so up to a point, but come on. Trying to say that after this ^ (look at above point) is ridiculous. I know there is such a thing as continuity, but face it; unless Yuma summoning Astral into this world released the Numbers across ALL OF SPACE-TIME, meaning they scattered everywhere along the time stream as well as around the globe (in which case I say: Great job Yuma, you are single-handedly responsible for screwing the ENTIRE UNIVERSE), I don't see how it's possible that he released them anymore. Aeron Solo wuz here (If you wanna talk) 00:02, December 30, 2013 (UTC)
- I really don't see how its impossible. So they're really old. That's fine. Some were used to seal Don Thousand, the rest were released by Yuma. There is no reason why the Numbers can't have history BEFORE Yuma released them. He released them. He didn't create them. Each Number can easily have its own history before being released (most probably don't, given the whole "based on the original owner" thing, but we've seen that some clearly do). I will say it once again. We do not know everything, but ZEXAL isn't over yet. They are slowing revealing more and more. I can't see there not being a clear (or at least acceptable) explanation by the end of the show.
- For now, there's no reason we can't just note the new information alongside the old. Cheesedude (talk • contribs) 00:26, December 30, 2013 (UTC)
- Ok putting it that way calms things down a bit. But I still don't like it. I feel like you're really working extremely hard to make the original idea work in context of each new development. Not to say that you're wrong; it sounds logical. But to me this interpretation is still slightly shaky. I'm not saying we need to act on my nervousness, because this is really all I have: a hunch and suspicions. Which are growing more and more with each new development, but hey; nothing said, nothing proven ^^ Aeron Solo wuz here (If you wanna talk) 00:52, December 30, 2013 (UTC)
- So, episode 140 finally puts the lid on this. A translation can be found here, but here's the gist of it: During Astral's battle with Don Thousand, parts of Astral's power were removed from him and became 50 of the "Numbers". Those fifty scattered across Earth and marked the location of the Numeron Code. Among those fifty were the seven Legendary Numbers, which sealed Thousand's power. He says the those seven Numbers chose their owners, as those seven people were "heroes and sages". So among those fifty would be the seven Legendaries, plus the four Gates of Numeron. That means when Astral appeared in episode 1, the remaining fifty were released. And how many Numbers did Yuma have at the WDC's end? 50. So that means "Master Key Beetle" and the rest of the "Numbers" the Barian Emperors used have to be among the first fifty. Cheesedude (talk • contribs) 05:56, February 10, 2014 (UTC)
Numbers 46, 62, and 107
- Alright, I don't know what to do here. I looked over the same moment in the episode twice. I saw the three Dragon Numbers (46, 62, and 107) become merged into Number 100. There was no indication they went back to Mizael or Kaito at all. Plus, this is a different case then the Arclight Numbers, as Kaito wasn't absorbed into Barian World, but died in front of Mizael on the moon. So, assuming they actually were merged together, who do we say owns them now? And if they were not merged together, how is it justified to say that Mizael owns them? NMBRHNTR64 (talk • contribs) 14:46, December 31, 2013 (UTC)
They did not merged. I do not know what episode you saw but the 3 cards were floating in the air, activated a big light that hit the floor unlocking Number 100. They did not merge, fused or anything like that. Plus since Kaito seems dead the logical outcome of the Numbers is that they are now with Mizael. And since we follow logic for the owners of Number we give the Numbers to him.
Numbers are very important cards. A duelist cannot leave them on the moon with a dead body. Also Dragluon was Mizael legendary Number and had a deep bound with that dragon. He could not have left it there on the moon. Until proven otherwise leave it with Mizael.
- I looked over that moment again. The 3 cards came together, emitted a huge light, then the lightning appeared and hit the moon. Ever figure that the lightning WAS the dragon? Pay close attention because you can easily notice that there was no sign the dragons returned to their owners, let alone Mizael having them, they simply just disappeared. Plus, if they did go back to their original owners, don't you think Kaito would have just given ALL the dragons to Mizael, instead of just Number 100?
- Don't forget the principle of the Numbers. They're pieces of Astral's memories, and there are 100 originals. Which leads the idea of not only the Numbers merging, but also an Over-Hundred Number merging (though Tachyon is certainly a special case) ending up sounding a bit silly in the proper context. We haven't seen Mizar leave yet either, so really, we don't know what's happening, and we probably won't for another two weeks (I doubt it'll be in the next episode.) I say we leave it as Unknown if we can't agree on it, but that's just my opinion. I'm not an admin, my opinion isn't final. Sanokal K-T (talk • contribs) 00:14, January 1, 2014 (UTC)
The "merging" thing is just your speculation. You saw those cards coming close and you speculate they merged, fused or something. We agreed that we go by logic from now on on Number holders. Mizar is a Number Hunter and he will now go at full force against Don Thousand to avenge his fellow Barians killed. There is no clear logic for him to leave Number 62, 46 and 107 on the moon. (Because they did not merge or rather, nothing of this was said in the anime. Like I said, it's only your speculation.)
The only and MOST logical outcome is that Mizael took those Numbers with him because Kaito is now dead. Unknown, just like in the past, is not a concrete answer because on the moon there were only Kaito, Mizael and Orbital 7. Orbital 7 is destroyed, Kaito is dead and Mizael is a Number Hunter who want to avenge his friends. Kaito entrusted him with the Numeron Dragon (maybe the most important Number out there) so why would not give No 62 as well?
This is the most logical and simple way to put it. Leave it like that until proven otherwise. Even though next episode is Nasch vs Vector we could see Mizael taking off to the Barian World and we may get new hints but as for now, this is it.
Also, the legend of the Dragons of Light and Time (on the tablet) it says like this: "Dragons of light and time, clash at thy place of birth. Then shall the eyes of the galaxies truly awaken for the first time, opening the gate to a new world."
The 2 Dragons No 107 and no 62 are meant to clash in battle not merge, fuse or anything. When the battle was over, the energy from the clash revived the Numeron Dragon.
Simple logic is simple.
- Logic? This is ZEXAL we are talking about. There is no logic. Can you provide any reasoning at all that proves that they were not merged? Can you provide any evidence that shows that Mizael has all three of those Numbers? All three cards came together, emitted light, then completely disappeared. It certainly LOOKS like they merged together, since three cards came together, but one came out. Besides, since we don't know all of the details, its fine to just say Unknown because NO ONE KNOWS FOR SURE WHAT HAPPENED TO THEM. NMBRHNTR64 (talk • contribs) 04:28, January 1, 2014 (UTC)
This is Zexal we're talking about and so far, anything that was logical happened. When no 96 was defeated by Yuma it was clear since episodes that it was not taken by him and instead stayed with Vector. Number 65 too since 65 was with No 96 but everyone just ranted for weeks about leaving Unknown. Also the show is all about Number Hunting so, if YOU cannot provide any real reasoning to the Numbers merging (aside the fact that you saw a particular animation in the episode and so YOU think that 3 cards merged into 1) then we continue to go by logic. Those Numbers are with Mizar now. If it will be proven wrong we will change it. Simple as that.
I kinda got the feeling that they had merged as well just by watching it for the first time. I'm not sure if that's what truly happened but that was just my gut feeling. We still don't know everything about the Numbers to speculate on what they are truly capable of or who owns them but I would change to Mizael for now just because of the logic behind it. KasaiWolf (talk • contribs) 11:14, January 1, 2014 (UTC)
Im not saying that they did not merge for sure. It could be that they fused togheter but as for now, it is only speculation. The Legend on the tablet says that when the 2 Dragons will clash in battle, the Numeron Dragon would revive. So, for now, we choose logic over speculation. And by logic all of those Numbers are still with Mizael.
No, the logical thing to do is just wait a couple days for the next Ep and see what Misael is up to. There is a good chance we can see if he has those Numbers or not. If we don't see anything, fine put Mizael there, but the logical thing to do is put Unknown for now because neither of us know ABSOLUTELY 100% FOR SURE WHAT THE HECK IS GOING ON. NMBRHNTR64 (talk • contribs) 17:43, January 1, 2014 (UTC)
If this is what you call logic we would have almost all Numbers given to Unknown. Starting by the Vetrix Family Numbers. And a page full of Unknown hurts the eyes of the viewers. There is no harm in leaving them to Mizael. Not only it is the most logical person to have them but if he will be revealed to not have them, we will simply correct and I dont think anyone will go to jail for this. But Unknown is so bad to see... especially when there are only 2 options left: Mizael or Kaito and Kaito is dead.
In case you haven't noticed, we already do have a page of Unknowns everywhere… Its called, Numbers we haven't seen in the anime yet. Numbers 18, 36, 57, etc. all have Unknown right there. This is about the facts, what we know and don't know. This is not about how people want to see things… Besides, the only reason the Arclight Numbers don't have Unknown next to them is because you kept whining and bringing up the same argument over and over again until people got tired and complied with you about it… NMBRHNTR64 (talk • contribs) 17:58, January 1, 2014 (UTC)
- Maybe because people started to see thing my way since it was logical.
About other Numbers that have not appeared in the anime I wont even answer since there is absolutely no point in bringing them up lol. As far as the other Number goes, I dont think that if I kept whining about them being owned Jaden Yuki or Yusei Fudo would have worked the same. Maybe other admins see things the way I see them. And this is my last message here because im pretty tired talking to you. It is for "Unknown" reasons lol Goodbye Sir. Yano88 (talk • contribs) 18:03, January 1, 2014 (UTC)
- Backing off? XD Alright I'll stay here if you want. Let's spam this talk session. They stay with Mizael since it is the most logical outcome.
What's your answer?!? lol
- Eh, Yano, the only reason that anything got anywhere last time was because I proposed a cease-fire, and we thus had something else to discuss besides everyone taking shots at each other (which I've just done. Sorry.) And NMBRHNT is right, we don't know what's happened. Unlike the Archlight Numbers though, it's much more likely that we'll see something happening, so let's just leave it FOR NOW, as NMBRHNT has said, and keep a cool head. Heads. Things. Sanokal K-T (talk • contribs) 21:41, January 1, 2014 (UTC)
Even IF those Numbers actually merged or fused, that would be another reason to list them with Mizael since he owns no 100, he owns all of them (Maybe he can de-fuse them and use at his will. Im just speculating on a speculation). And they did not fuse anyway since the tablet said that in order to free no 100 is needed that those dragons had to clash in battle on the moon. There is no harm in leaving them with Mizar also because the most logical answer is this. They did not fuse, if they did they would be spiritually with Mizar anyway, they were not taken by orbital 7, they did not remain with Kaito (no way Mizar, after knowing his true past, would leave Dragluon with a dead body on the moon also the main plot of the anime is to collect Numbers, not leaving them into the ground ESPECIALLY the moon that Yuma cannot reach. Also now Mizar has to avenge Durbe, Merag and Kaito too so he wants to go against Don Thousand at full power and since he wont be using Tachyon because it belongs to DT to begin with, he has all the reasons to power up his deck with 46, 62 and 100), they did not lost themselves into space. Let's leave it that way until and IF it will ever be proven otherwise. Now I feel tired after writing so many logical reasons in favor to Mizael... I go to sleep. Yano88 (talk • contribs) 01:59, January 2, 2014 (UTC)
- I have to say I was surprised this was even in question. To me, it really looked they merged. The other three cards were gone after the dragon appeared.
- The legend was vague, as most legends are. It simply said the two have to battle on the Moon and the key to the code would appear. That doesn't mean the key couldn't have already existed in the form of the three dragons.
- I suppose it is ambiguous. I would agree we should just list them all as belonging to Mizar now with a note that they may have been merged. Also, I do agree we can do away with the "Seven Barian Emperors" distinction for holders. We can bite the bullet and say Nasch has the IV's Numbers and Mizar has III and V's. Cheesedude (talk • contribs) 05:18, January 2, 2014 (UTC)
Number S39 Symbol
So, Number S39 is been out for a while. Can anyone provide a coloured symbol instead of the old manga pic?
- No, its not out yet. We just have a pic of what it will look like. NMBRHNTR64 (talk • contribs) 17:43, January 1, 2014 (UTC)
- ... and... that is not good? Cant we take the symbol from that image? XD
- Alright. Thank you.
Why dont we use the image posted by (I think it's him) Photonkrios99 ? It's pretty clear and anyway is better than the manga version.
- Dat Don Thousand… he wields power from the Numeron Code now, so it could be a legit Number… then again, there were all those fake ones he created, and the "new" Numbers (1-4) could be fake too (then again, Numeron powers can make them legit). Ugh… so many questions and no answers in sight. I agree that waiting for the EP is best, but I also feel uneasy putting the Numbers 1-4 in the chart, but with no evidence supporting they are fake, I guess I will just keep my big mouth shut for now… NMBRHNTR64 (talk • contribs) 02:45, February 3, 2014 (UTC)
- Those are said to be the real Numbers (No.1-4) in the newest episode, so why do you feel uneasy? I really think that the people on this wikia should watch the raw episodes or go to NeoArkCradle to look at the translation. It's really, really irritating when I see a bunch of people being so uncertain despite the newest episode blatantly clarifying on the issue and it is all because they don't understand Japanese. We don't know whether Number 1000 is legit or not, but No. 1-4 is the real deal. Jeez. Samhiuy (talk • contribs) 03:09, February 4, 2014 (UTC)
- Yeah I had no doubt at all about them. I watched the raw episode and as soon as DT summons no 4 Yuma says something that can be translated as "So that's the real no 4". Anyway this should not even be discussed as every new Under Hundred Numbers should be placed within the true Numbers until proven otherwise. At least that's my opinion.
- I don't see how he's being a dick. He's making a very valid point, and if you don't understand Japanese, and therefore don't understand the content of the episode, what right do you have to raise doubts? Well, I suppose you have every right to, at the risk of looking like a fool.--YamiWheeler (talk • contribs) 16:32, February 4, 2014 (UTC)
- He was being one by acting like I am a freaking moron… I can usually tell what is happening by simply watching the episode. Given the circumstances, you can see how I could question the validity of the Numbers. DT having a history of making Fake Numbers as well as now being near-omnipotent with the powers of the Numeron Code. Plus, look at their effects -_-. I get that they are real, and it is my bad for not doing my research, but that is no excuse for you treating me like I am an idiot. Even if that was not your intention, your wording sure made it seem like it was, especially by ending your post with "Jeez". NMBRHNTR64 (talk • contribs) 18:04, February 4, 2014 (UTC)
Ok, now that we've all calmed down (hopefully), I can say that this subject is closed, there is no Number "1000" confirmed to exist, because C1000 was summoned directly, without regular Number 1000 as an intermediary. Case closed. Aeron Solo wuz here (If you wanna talk) 01:49, February 10, 2014 (UTC)
Sorry to be that guy, but sword that sword really count as 62's sealed form? It's not really all that different to how GE and NGE are summoned. --Rocket.knight.777 (talk • contribs) 15:58, February 9, 2014 (UTC)
- The "crest" that appears when "Galaxy-Eyes" is Summoned appears to have "Galaxy-Eyes" grow from it, if I remember rightly (and the idea that these are sealed forms of the Galaxy-Eyes monsters has been tossed around for ages) so it should count. Don't worry about being that guy, it's a valid question. Sanokal K-T (talk • contribs) 02:13, February 10, 2014 (UTC)
Re-Write some of the Numbers descriptions
Why do we have descriptions of Rank-Down Numbers and Rank-Up Numbers generalized and pluralized? In the anime only Utopia was the first and only one Number ranked-down and the OCG/TCG version of Numeron Fall suggests that no other Number aside from Utopia will ever be ranked-down. The following sentence is wrong to me: "These are Number Monsters that are downgraded versions of regular Number Monsters." because it lets figure it out that there are several Ranked-Down Numbers out there while there is only one. I suggest to modify the description. Yano88 (talk • contribs) 16:00, February 28, 2014 (UTC)
All the Numbers in Astrals Possession??
So, know that Anime Astral has all 100 Numbers, does that mean the manga and game original Numbers should be given a "Yuma Tsukumo/Astral (anime)" tag on them?
- Now that he has all of them, I believe its time to re-structure this article. We can note at the top of the chart that "every Number eventually came into Astral's possession." Then we just change to use an "owner(s)" column that lists everyone else ever known to have it (including Yuma if its one of the Numbers that were actually shown in the anime). Cheesedude (talk • contribs) 16:01, March 2, 2014 (UTC)
- Would it be worth changing the coloum heeding for 'Previous' and 'Current' to 'Anime' and 'Manga', then using the same thing that used on the Number C table and bolding the most recent owner in each continuity, and continue with the 'Unknown' label with the manga?
|#||Monster||Sealed Form||Owner(s)||Number Location|
|Illumiknight|| Kite Tenjo|
Dr. Faker (anime)
|Kaito Tenjo (manga)||Right shoulder plate|
I say we go with that. It would make better sense than what we got now. The only reason the below topic was started was because I didn't see this one. I think Photon has the right idea. --Rocket.knight.777 (talk • contribs) 23:37, March 3, 2014 (UTC)
- Seriously, no one else wants to talk about this? I think Photon's suggestion is the best way to go here. --Rocket.knight.777 (talk • contribs) 14:38, March 9, 2014 (UTC)
Manga Numbers in the Anime?
I release it may be safe to assume that the Numbers we see in the Manga (as well as those release in the TCG/OCG without being seen) are in Yuma and Astral's possession in the anime (supposedly), but should they really be listed on the table since we don't see them at all in the anime? I think they should really only be listed in where we see them (in the case of Numbers like 55 and 18, we just put like N/A or something). --Rocket.knight.777 (talk • contribs) 22:53, March 3, 2014 (UTC)
- We dont see them but they are confirmed to be in Yuma/Astral possession. So yes, we list all the Numbers with them. Yano88 (talk • contribs) 22:56, March 3, 2014 (UTC)
- Whether or not the Numbers they are talking about in the anime are the same ones that are in the manga is still up in the air. That alternate world that is the manga is still being developed, and whether or not Zombiestein is the same Number 22 in the anime as it was in the manga is anyone's guess. The anime Number are confirmed to all be in Yuma's possession; the manga Numbers are not, nor are the 9 Numbers in the TCG/OCG. There is nothing wrong with waiting until the manga is done before lumping all the Numbers together under one owner. This isn't fanfiction where the writer can fuse the two universes together. The manga and anime are separate from each (atm), and it should be reflected here. --Rocket.knight.777 (talk • contribs) 23:25, March 3, 2014 (UTC)
- Lets hear everyone's opinion about that. I vote against of course. While the anime and the manga may be alternate universe, writers of both the anime and the manga works for the same company. They were told what Numbers to use in the anime and what Numbers to use in the manga. We'll never see in the manga a different Number 69, for example. Proof is that both 39 and 17 are the same as the anime. Really to me this topic is useless but im not a monarch so let's vote for it... Yano88 (talk • contribs) 23:30, March 3, 2014 (UTC)
- You want to create a whole new set of 100 Numbers. By your logic, Number 39 Utopia should not be listed with Yuma/Astral but with Yuma/Astral (anime) AND with Yuma/Astral (manga). Since they are whole separate universe it would work like that. As far as the anime goes, if we go by your logic, we'll write that Yuma collected all 100 Numbers but that we know almost about 60 of them. The rest will forever be unknown. Because even when the manga will end, there will be no guarantee that the remaining manga Numbers were the same as the Numbers. As you see your logic fails under several points but let's wait for others to tell their opinions. Yano88 (talk • contribs) 00:03, March 4, 2014 (UTC)
Number 0 case
In the Zexal last episode preview, proves the existence of number 00, that are supposed to not exists because whit the revelation of the number 100 apparently proves that all number are of 1-100 not 0-99. But whit the number 00, this affirmation becomes again a theory, whose that mean can cont as a extra under-one number (1-100 is legit) or the numeron dragon is legit over-hundred boss of all others and ins't part of the 100 original but a extra boss/god number (0-99 is legit). Some persons can say that is a fake, but this is improbable, since don thousand haves died, all his fake numbers a probable destroyed. This open some theories:
- Number 0 is legit and numeron dragon is extra original boss number: Numeron dragon or numeron code creats all other numbers (0-99) plus two galaxy-eyes (that eventually becomes numbers), then as the father (or progenitor) of all number he don't cont, then eventually a numeron dragon reborn as a new number (number 100)
- Number 0 is a extra and numeron dragon is one of 100 originals: he/she/it is created using the power of numeron code or dragon by someone or is the embodiment of numeron code power in number form.
- The less probable, yuma using his raw will power and win desire via the chaos power creates a extra number to defeat astral. This theory can be sustained due the fact of yuma are able to uses shining draw whit chaos power to creates main deck cards, then this can also probable applied to the extra deck, since during the last duel whit tron, via zexal the haves created a non-evolution ZW card from extra deck instance of the main, whose you cannot shining draw cards, only summon then.
- Leave it until next episode when we find out which number Astral refers to as Yuma's, if its 0 we can move it to its own section. Photonkrios99 (talk • contribs) 18:07, March 16, 2014 (UTC)
- Here's what I think. Since Astral is the "Original Number", 'Number 0' likely belonging to him. Since Yuma's last name, "Tsukumo", means 99, 'Number 99' will likely belonging to him. (Before getting confused or confusing others, note that this is a speculation.)Shadowdarkone1 (talk • contribs) 00:35, March 18, 2014 (UTC)
99, a number between 1-100, I wonder were they are surpassed to be right now. Any way time and a place, lets wait till Sunday to sort this out. Photonkrios99 (talk • contribs) 00:37, March 18, 2014 (UTC)
Guys hold on. The Numeron Dragon BORROWED the power of the Numbers to hide its own existence according to the Legend of the Dragons of Light and Time. If it already had the power of the Numbers, it wouldn't need to "borrow" it right? Besides that, the Numeron Dragon is really its own force, being neither barian nor astral world in origin. It would only make sense for it to be between the original 100 and the Over-Hundred Numbers if it were to be given a placement. I simply think it's IMPOSSIBLE that, as the origin of the Numeron Code, it could be part of Astral's Numbers, because that would imply that the Numeron Code is from the Astral World, which it couldn't have been since the Numeron Dragon existed even before anything else right? Aeron Solo wuz here (If you wanna talk) 12:11, March 18, 2014 (UTC)
- That makes sense, but we are also talking about cards that appeared way back in the past and, if canon with the main YGO timeline, appeared before the game even existed. We have no logic to go by here until we see the finale. No reason to start assuming things. NMBRHNTR64 (talk • contribs) 12:21, March 18, 2014 (UTC)
- So to summarize the end of this topic, turns out 0 was F0. Great. So we can assume that the 100 Numbers assertion refer to 1-100. But I'd like to point out a minor problem with this: Apparently Astral calls Number 99 the apex and/or last of the Numbers during the episode.
- I assume you can see what problems arise from that statement. But you know what, I'm not going to bother wrapping my head around it because I'm frankly done with Zexal since it's over, we had a nice time let's move on.
List of Numbers by Media Background
For the sake of the people who are new to Yu-Gi-Oh, like the guy who was looking over my shoulder at the time I was making this, I put up a list to separate the Numbers in Yu-Gi-Oh Zexal's media forms. This doesn't include Number X or Number 10X cards since those are the most obvious.
- Number 1: Gate of Numeron - Ekam
- Number 1: Infection Buzz King
- Number 2: Gate of Numeron - Dve
- Number 2: Shadow Mosquito Ninja
- Number 3: Gate of Numeron - Trini
- Number 3: Cicada King
- Number 4: Gate of Numeron - Catvari
- Number 4: Stealth Kragen
- Number 5: Doom Chimera Dragon (Somewhat...)
- Number 7: Lucky Straight
- Number 8: Heraldic King Genom-Heritage
- Number 10: Dark Illumiknight
- Number 11: Big Eye
- Number 12: Crimson Shadow Armor Ninja
- Number 15: Gimmick Puppet Giant Grinder
- Number 19: Freezadon
- Number 25: Force Focus
- Number 30: Acid Golem of Destruction
- Number 32: Shark Drake
- Number 33: Chronomaly Machu Mech
- Number 34: Terror-Byte
- Number 39: Beyond the Hope
- Number 39: Utopia Roots
- Number 43: Manipulator of Souls
- Number 44: Sky Pegasus
- Number 53: Heart-eartH
- Number 54: Lion Heart
- Number 56: Gold Rat
- Number 58: Burner Viser
- Number 62: Galaxy-Eyes Prime Photon Dragon
- Number 64: Ronin Raccoon Sandayu
- Number 65: Djinn Buster
- Number 66: Master Key Beetle
- Number 69: Heraldry Crest
- Number 73: Abyss Splash
- Number 80: Rhapsody in Berserk
- Number 83: Galaxy Queen
- Number 88: Gimmick Puppet of Leo
- Number 92: Heart-eartH Dragon
- Number 94: Crystal Zero
- Number 96: Dark Mist
- Number 99: Hope Dragun
- Number 100: Numeron Dragon
- Number 13: Embodiment of Crime
- Number 14: Greedy Sarameya
- Number 21: Frozen Lady Justice
- Number 22: Zombiestein
- Number 23: Lancelot, Dark Knight of the Underworld
- Number 28: Titanic Moth
- Number 31: Embodiment of Punishment
- Number 35: Ravenous Tarantula
- Number 37: Hope Woven Dragon Spider Shark
- Number 38: Hope Harbinger Dragon Titanic Galaxy
- Number 42: Galaxy Tomahawk
- Number 47: Nightmare Shark
- Number 48: Shadow Lich
- Number 50: Blackship of Corn
- Number 52: Diamond Crab King
- Number 63: Shamoji Soldier
- Number 70: Malevolent Sin
- Number 72: Shogi Rook
- Number 77: The Seven Sins
- Number 82: Heartlandraco
- Number 84: Pain Gainer
- Number 91: Thunder Spark Dragon
- Number 93: Utopia Kaiser
- Number 95: Galaxy-Eyes Dark Matter Dragon
- Number 6: Chronomaly Atlandis
- Number 9: Dyson Sphere
- Number 10: Illumiknight
- Number 17: Leviathan Dragon
- Number 20: Giga-Brilliant
- Number 39: Utopia
- Number 40: Gimmick Puppet of Strings
- Number 46: Dragluon
- Number 61: Volcasaurus
- Number 18: Heraldry Patriarch
- Number 24: Dragulas the Vampiric Dragon
- Number 26
- Number 27
- Number 29: Mannequin Cat
- Number 36: Chronomaly Chateau Huyuk
- Number 41: Bagooska the Terribly Tired Tapir
- Number 45: Crumble Logos the Prophet of Demolition
- Number 49: Fortune Tune
- Number 51: Finisher the Strong Arm
- Number 55: Gogogo Goliath
- Number 57: Tri-Head Dust Dragon
- Number 59: Crooked Cook
- Number 60
- Number 67: Pair-a-Dice Smasher
- Number 68: Sanaphond the Sky Prison
- Number 71: Rebarian Shark
- Number 74: Master of Blades
- Number 75: Bamboozling Gossip Shadow
- Number 76
- Number 78: Number Archive
- Number 79: Battlin' Boxer Nova Caesar
- Number 81: Superdreadnought Rail Cannon Super Dora
- Number 85: Crazy Box
- Number 86: Heroic Champion - Rhongomyniad
- Number 87: Queen of the Night
- Number 89: Diablosis the Mind Hacker
- Number 90
- Number 97
- Number 98: Antitopian
- Cheers I was trying to keep track of this a while back, but long since been on extended leave. Might make use of it when they finally release all of them (or when they just stop) --slave(command•works) 05:45, June 23, 2014 (UTC)
"4" in Numbers notation
A while back I brought up the topic of the 4 in the picture for the Numbers notation being incorrect. However, scrolling through the Numbers, I have discovered this assertion to be both true AND false; compare it in "Number 42: Galaxy Tomahawk" and "Number 48: Shadow Lich". They're both already released, and both demonstrate two different versions of the number 4. Anime has been fairly consistent, using the version demonstrated in "48" (just go to "Number 40: Gimmick Puppet of Strings" and you'll see), but the manga...well, scroll to "Number 14: Greedy Sarameya" and... :P
I still want to change the image because I'm pretty sure the majority of the Numbers use the version depicted on Number 48. But I'm not sure anymore. I did edit the image though if you people wanna override it. Aeron Solo wuz here (If you wanna talk) 19:33, May 20, 2014 (UTC)